The Fuji X compacts future

Discussion in 'Fuji X Series News and Rumors' started by lights and shadows, Feb 18, 2013.

  1. lights and shadows

    lights and shadows FujiXspot Rookie

    15
    Feb 18, 2013
    Guangzhou (China)
    These days we are seeing a lot of new advanced compact cameras arriving the market. Some of these cameras have small sensors and very fast lenses, like Panasonic LX7 or Samsung EX2. There are also cameras like Sony RX100 or Canon G1X with a big sensor and very slow lenses. Just in middle is the Fuji X20, with a medium sized sensor and a quite fast lens. All these cameras are different, of course, because Sony´s camera don´t have integrated nor external viewfinder nor articulated screen and so is the worst in ergonomics. Also the 24 mm wide angle lens of the LX7 seems to be more desirable than the 28 mm lens of Fuji X20.

    In my opinion, as I prefer to shoot at low ISOs and with image stabilisation disabled, it would be highly desirable a faster lens in the tele end (maybe f/2.0), that also helps to get a shallow depth of field. A bigger sensor would also led to a shallow depth of field, but increases the overall size of the camera and probably diminishes the luminosity of the lens. Also would like a zoom beginning at 24 mm, not 28 mm.

    This said, what would you prefer for the next generation of Fuji X compacts?
     
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  2. RT_Panther

    RT_Panther FujiXspot Veteran

    461
    Feb 2, 2013
    Texas
    Don't know if I'd call the RX100 lens slow since it's 1.8 at the 28mm end :)
     
  3. lights and shadows

    lights and shadows FujiXspot Rookie

    15
    Feb 18, 2013
    Guangzhou (China)
    1.8 large aperture at the wide end is not important because:
    -at the wide end you can use slower shutter speed
    -at the wide end depth of field is always big
    You can compare tele end f/2.8 in Fuji X20 and f/4.9 in Sony RX100 instead. The depth of field is shallower in the Fuji X20 despite its smaller sensor. You can read about this here:
    http://www.dpreview.com/previews/fujifilm-x20
     
  4. RT_Panther

    RT_Panther FujiXspot Veteran

    461
    Feb 2, 2013
    Texas
    Oh for sure, the 20 is a faster lens through the entire FL range....:)
     
  5. carlb

    carlb FujiXspot Veteran

    268
    Feb 6, 2013
    twin cities, minnesota
    Carl
    To get that shallow depth of field going even on the tele end you're going to need some combination of large(-ish) sensor with fast(-ish) lens. Both tend to drive up the size of the camera, so if you try to exchange one for the other, the overall camera size won't change too much.

    So, next generation of Fuji compacts ...

    Okay, I'd like personally like to see them do the 1" sensor size (ala Nikon, Sony) with interchangeable lenses. Where they'd differentiate themselves would be shorter mount-to-sensor distance than the Nikons, so that wide-angle lenses could at least be slim. Longer lenses (with some primes fast enough for real bokeh) would have to be deeper and fatter, of course, but they'd still be smaller than m43.

    But, that's a whole new mount, which I doubt Fuji can do right now.
     
  6. Nic

    Nic FujiXspot Regular

    118
    Feb 5, 2013
    Brisbane, Australia
    I think that the key to opening up the advanced compact market to people who had only previously shot with larger (usually DSLR) cameras was by fitting larger sensors into smaller bodies. This started in interchangeable-lens form with Micro 4/3 and then continued with fixed-lens camera like the X1, DP1/2, X100, G1X, and on an even smaller scale with the RX100. I personally don't see a future for myself in cameras with sub-Micro 4/3 sized sensors, but I won't totally write them off just yet. Maybe the present 1" sensor as in the RX100 would be fine, but I'd first like to see it presented in a form larger than the RX100 with better controls and a lens designed more for speed and quality than tiny size. I feel the current RX100 is too small a camera for me.
     
  7. carlb

    carlb FujiXspot Veteran

    268
    Feb 6, 2013
    twin cities, minnesota
    Carl
    Agree completely. I'd like to see Fuji give the 1" sensor the X10/X20 treatment. The camera would have to be larger, naturally. But I could see a great opportunity for something almost as big as an OMD, with fast and sharp telescoping fixed zoom that folds mostly into the body.

    Given the Fuji controls, picture quality, and an EVF, I for one would be all over that camera.
     
  8. lights and shadows

    lights and shadows FujiXspot Rookie

    15
    Feb 18, 2013
    Guangzhou (China)
    Ok, let´s see: A compact fixed lens camera OMD sized, with a 1" sensor, fast telescoping 4.5x zoom 24-108 mm, constant aperture f/2.0, EVF, tilting screen, good cinema mode with external micro and the ergonomics and look of the X20. I would pay over $1000 for that little jewel.
     
  9. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs FujiXspot Veteran

    485
    Feb 1, 2013
    Near Philadephila
    I don't see any real point in going smaller than m43 for an ILC - some of those body/lens combinations are already more than small enough for anything you'd want an ILC for and, of course, there are larger purpose-specific options for when you want/need them. But for a fixed lens, zoom camera, I agree that the 1" sensor could be the basis of something pretty great, which the RX100 hints at but they stuffed into way too small a body with too many compromises (for me) associated with that. So, yeah, put it in something the size of an OMD or X100, go 24-90 (or a bit longer), apertures as fast as the X10/X20 or faster (the LX7's f1.4-2.3 is an even nicer target), and I think you've got a camera that a lot of people would be happy with as a primary carry. I'd personally be more excited about a Pany LX-9 version than a Fuji X-30, but that's just down to features and tradeoffs - I'd love to see this sensor used in updated and somewhat larger versions of the X20, the LX7, the XZ2, and whoever else wants to jump into it. Seeing how good the sensor is in the RX100, its potential in a less compromised camera is pretty exciting.

    -Ray
     
  10. theoldsmithy

    theoldsmithy FujiXspot Regular

    104
    Feb 4, 2013
    Herefordshire, England
    Martin Connolly
    +1 (at least) to that
     
  11. Armanius

    Armanius FujiXspot Top Veteran

    691
    Feb 1, 2013
    Texas
    Muttley
    +2. Except for the price tag. Make it $999.
     
  12. Nic

    Nic FujiXspot Regular

    118
    Feb 5, 2013
    Brisbane, Australia
    Sounds interesting, although I'd like to see what a constant f/2 lens is going to look like. f/2-2.8 might be more achievable, particularly if some degree of compactness is going to be maintained. Still, even if something like this were to cost $1000 I'm wondering why I should be paying $300 more than I did for a Canon G1X when it was new almost a year ago. For that money I'd be wanting to see the full 16MP APS-C sensor and a compact, collapsible version of the 18-55mm optic.
     
  13. Biro

    Biro Super Moderator Subscribing Member

    524
    Feb 1, 2013
    Jersey Shore
    Steve

    That would be the compact camera to end all compact cameras. :)